Our agitation is not about this. Its about minimizing misuse and being more effective. For eg: when it comes to the really backward ppl, hardly any consider getting into higher education. We need to break the cycle and tht requires inflow of money and social status, which comes through jobs. Its a gud idea to reserve seats for backward classes for clerical jobs etc. At higher level, the reservations wud be much misused.
Besides, as I say, regional specificity needs to be taken into account. Jats are quite an elite group in Haryana, it doesnt make a lot of sense to provide them with reservations.

I don’t agree with you here. I can tell you about lakhs of people belonging to the general category but who don’t have the means to go in for higher education. Why is there no reservation for them? Its the govt. who is dividing the people on the basis of caste. They should stop this and provide opputunities and reservations to people on the basis of their financial status.

How many govt. schols offer free education? Fine, they charge a very small fee but the constitution states that education till the age of 14 years is free. Why doesn’t the govt. work to reduce the drop-out rate? Why doesn’t the govt. make the children capable enough so that they can actually compete at higher levels. They might offer them reservations here in India. But what wil happen when they go abroad? Nobody’s gonna offer them reservations there.

It is simply vote bank politics. Why did Arjun Singh address a bunch of pro-reservation activists whereas he refused to address the anti-reservations one before the elections? He is a bloody hypocrite.

Reservation has not and will never work.

And as Kalyani said, it is about minimizing the misuse. Even if they offer reservations, there should be a rule that if one member of the family makes use of reservation, then nobody from the family can ever apply for reservations.

Rahul–> Managing a country like India is no mean job. Free education, though needed, may not be immediately plausible. Of course, its vote-bank politics, but then everything is vote-bank politics, a country progresses due to vote-bank politics, so its really pointless to condemn Arjun Singh on this point.
Nyway, its imp. to appreciate tht reservations r not so as to help the economically backward as such. Most certainly no. They are for removing the ADDITIONAL constraints the SOCIALLY backward classes feel, while trying to improve their economic status.
And this is not division on the basis of caste (that is, unless we choose it to be so), the purpose served can be quite the opposite if we want it.
But yes, as I said before, I do not see much logic in providing reservations in centres of higher education.

Agreed managing India is tough. But do you think, asking for free education, even after 50 years is unreasonable??!

And condemning Arjun Singh is not at all pointless. The man is giving stupid excuses. He is even challenging the Knowledge Commission. God help him.

And why just help the socially backward? That’s what I stressing upon. Help the economically weaker sections. A house maid could be a from a higher caste but do she or her children enjoy the benefits of free education? NO. Reservations on basis of castes is a totally stupid concept.

i said this in school n am saying it again.
SHUN D RESERVATIONS, instead have it on the basis of merit and economic criteria. see avantika, some1 from the creamy layer of sc’, st’s might not be misusing the reservation facility given to them but majority are! instead of us shouting about complete eradication or upliftment of reservationd, we should think of ways which are practical, right and help those in need n deserving. the cut-off for any course in any pclr edu. institution should not come down just bcoz of the reserved seats! i say again, if a person belonging to sc/st/obc(not from the creamy layer) tops the IAS, we, belonging to the general category—wud be really happy!

n if reservations can’t be abolished, have them from the elementary level. tell the govt. to go to those remote(non-linked) areas and bloody spread edu there.

c, debate is of no use , if some solution does not crop up. so, instead og pulling the legs of odrs n sayin V R RIGHT, lets analyse again as to what can be done.. !

Kalyani I agree with u that there are jats and some others who are taking advatage of the reservations, in simple words yes, they are misusing reservation.
But here are certain points that I wud want to clear-
1.reservations need to be kept with a strong economic criteria which can easily tell us who deserves it and who doesn’t. like divya said, it is then when the reservation and its use actually comes into being.
2.we say that India is too young an economy to be compared with U.K or U.S.A. well, if it is so 4 economic reasons then it is the same 4 social reasons too. Rahul, do u think the lack of awareness and illiteracy that has been in our country since ages can be removed within 50 years??? it might fall short but we cant say that the reservations have not helped bcoz it has made a hell lot of difference.
3.as I can see that DEAR MR. ARJUN SINGH is favourite here too, let me unleash a dirty truth about him here (which I’m sure many of u might be aware of) his own son will be soon contesting the nxt election from Madhya pradesh, which as we all know has a majority of backward classes and hence wants to win support. I absolutely agree that the politicians have always used the masses as vote-banks only, which all the more requires a serious action on this issue!!!

well , the govt is trying to categorize the casteism. yes i do agree that the intention for implementing reservation policy is to uplift the scheduled caste/obc`s. but it is just mere for vote bank.

Awantika I don’t think that 50 years is a small time. In these fifty years, the govt. hasn’t once been able to implement their 5 year plans properly. On the other hand, the politicians themselves have amassed wealth that would’ve taken them more than 100 years.

Its the system that stinks. Is it so tough to build proper schools for kids? The money the govt. spends on advertising what good they have done for the people can be used to provide free books. It is these things that will make a difference. Reservations will get them nowhere. It will only increase the economic gap and India will turn into another Brazil.

In reservations, the student’s actual worth is not taken into account. Its just his “birth”.

haha! love your ?????? and!!!!!!! avantika! well, my views are similar to kalyani..no point writin here again.

hundreds of ppl line up every day, in front of the sri tirumala temple in tirupati. well, thats not a new thing for a country like india. but the ppl belonging to the vaishnava brahmin community (v.b.c) are the only ones who are allowed to make the laddus there.
( i mean the prashad) where has it been established that only the ppl from the vbc are competent enough to make laddus at tirupati? are the rest by birth incompetent to do the same??? the vocation is “reserved” for that community. when we think of laddus, we think of haldiram and sindhi, they deserve it better than the vbc….
dont they???
i know i am pointed out smething that is highly amusing, i mean wat connection does laddus have with reservation…
but my dear frnds here is where i wish to make a point…the govt has not divided us on the basis of caste it is we who have done that.[here is where my opinion differs frm softykid] so rahul i feel there is no use blaming the govt for that. bcoz the govt has not made these age old traditions, but we have. we live in the world’s largest democracy. if we blame the govt, we are at fault too, coz no one else but we have put them there…..

I agree with u. There is no meaning in blaming govt. for promoting casteism. And yes, reservations shud be kept for those who are BOTH socially and financially backward.

i appreciate your point of view. but if the govt is keen interested in the upliftment , my view is try to give importance to the foundation or basic education in school level, bring more and more IIT`S and IIM`S, so that those from the backward or sc/st, students get enough oppurtunity .or else just cancel the fees for those obc`s and sc/st students who really wish to pursue higher education.ok if it is upto school level its ok,but. by reserving seats , the govt is sending a wrong signal that no matter whatever your marks are but you have a seat. i

Avantika –> The govt. isnt helping the SC’s and ST’s by reserving seats. They are just further widening the gap.

Nabeel –> I totally agree with you. It sends out wrong signals.

Despite how we shud have achieved much more than we did in the past 50 yrs, the fact is we havent. Increasing the capacity in such institutes is tough, coz it reguires infrastructural development. Tho they shud proceed with the decision (to a certain extent), coz the rest wud follow. I am against reservations coz I feel many parts of the proposal aint a gud idea, but as such, I feel they are required. And I still agree with Avantika tht govt. isnt widening the gap.

Why is tht we havent done a lot since our independence. Corruption, over-population. And wat are the problems plaguing us: poverty, unemployment, wastage of resources, some of the social customs etc. Wat wud protest do? Try ensure tht reservations arent implemented. But the problem is not here. If not reservations, then something else, in some other way.

1.we proudly say that today we have removed untouchability from the very face of india, but the reality is that there are ppl still being discriminated.
2.the last msg was an eg of another kind of reservation. the only difference is that the govt never implemented it, but we did.

even when we know that the quota system or reservation is not the best option, we still have to keep it as a remedial measure becoz everything else has failed anyways…as both the pts abv suggest-the society has failed to live by the basic principles of social justice and without doubt the govt’s promises have landed us no where.
in tamil nadu, the state where we have almost 70% reservation, let me remind u there is an excellent literacy rate too. the fact is that it provides an opportunity for the backward ppl, its another way to uplift them.
BUT if reservations are to be removed then—
1. as we harp about the fact that we have provided the backward classes with incentives and reservations on primary and secondary levels like the govt schools, but before removing reservations these govt schools have to give better teachers and better edu. stds to match up with the high competition that exists today.

2.if we are to lead a protest lets also include the religious factor in it. after all that is a form of exploitation and reservation too.

3.ppl are all up against the caste reservations, but then why support women reservations….if caste based reservations is not acceptable…
then is gender based reservations acceptable….!!!!